Caravan Parks (Wales) Bill

[TreeTops]

Holiday Caravan Park (Wales) Bill

Welsh Assembly Member, Darren Millar, has for quite a few years been raising concerns about people using Caravan Holiday Homes as permanent or main residences.

It's an issue many in the industry are against, but Mr Millar has used terms such as ghetto which has not gone down well with parks or caravan owners.

Back in April, Mr Millar put a bill into the Sennedd Ballot and he was lucky enough to be drawn. The following items were the proposed for the bill at the time of the ballot.

• unlawful occupation of caravans
• the powers available to local authorities to address unlawful occupation of caravans
• the resources available to enforce operating conditions on holiday caravan park licences
• the fitness of persons operating/owning holiday caravan parks
• abuses by some holiday caravan park owners of holiday caravan owners on their sites
• the cost of providing public services to those who use holiday caravans as their main home

On June 19th there was a plenary debate to introduce Mr Millars bill to the Sennedd. There was cross party support for the new bill and Mr Millar was given 9 months to draft the contents of the bill.

The bill is now in consultation stage, the consultation document can be found here: http://www.assemblywales.org/letter_..._paper-e-2.pdf

The consultation document boils down to 12 questions:

Consultation questions
01. What are your views on the current licensing system for holiday caravan sites? How can the current law be modernised?

02. Do local authorities have sufficient powers and resources to enforce site licence conditions? If not, what powers and resources do they need?

03. Should local authorities be able to charge for site licences and should licences last for a fixed period of time?

04. How can the issue of people occupying holiday caravans on holiday parks as their sole or main residence best be dealt with? What is the scale of this problem and what impact will it have on the holiday caravan industry in the longer term?

05. What impact do people occupying holiday caravans as their sole or main residence have on holiday caravan sites and local communities?

06. What risks are associated with people occupying holiday caravans as their sole or main residence?

07. What unintended consequences could arise as a result of this legislation? What steps could be taken to deal with these consequences?

08. Should site owners or managers be subject to a fit and proper person test and, if so, what matters should this test take into account?

09. Do owners of holiday caravans have sufficient legal protection and are they able to exercise their existing legal rights? If not, what needs to be changed?

10. Should there be a legal requirement for site owners to provide caravan owners with a written licence agreement, and should this be in a standard format?

11. What would be the impact on the holiday caravan industry should there be any additional regulation or costs as a result of this legislation? How can any impact be mitigated and what other groups could incur costs?

12. Do you have any other comments you wish to make on my proposals?


This consultation is open to everyone, if you wish to submit comments you must do so by Friday, September 13, 2013.

I've lots of views with I am sure you will draw out with discussion in this thread. I would say that I think Mr Millar does have a good grip of the situation, he really understands the issues and the dodges that people are using to live on parks. I've not met many other Politians who have the same level understanding.

My worry is that of unintended consequences, unintentional damage done to the parks and the people who love them.

I'd encourage you all to respond to the bill, but wait until this thread has developed before you do as I've changed my views a few times having debated the points.

So folks, let the debate begin. What do you have to say? I should say I've yet to respond to the bill, so your comments may influence my response to the consultation.

[treetopper]

Council Tax would have to go up to cover all the extra council employees to actually check legality of van owners Home address.
As an example the licence granted to a 12 month site after appeal has conditions that they have to have an update list of van owners addresses...ALLEDGELY peeps lived on site when it was a 10.5 month site...

[TreeTops]

I think they will make the park responsible or checking that their customers don't live on the park. There's a suggestion of a license charge being applied to parks by the council to pay for council officials to check the park over.

[treetopper]

Originally Posted by TreeTops

I think they will make the park responsible or checking that their customers don't live on the park. There's a suggestion of a license charge being applied to parks by the council to pay for council officials to check the park over.

As I said in other threads maybe that is why more and more sites seem to be are going for the 12 months while they can get them.

[michaelr1946]

I think quite honestly ,that this is another blatant example of "Big Brother " wishing to poke the nose into the lives of ordinary people ( the easy option !! ) , and if at all possible , make their bit of pleasure in life as uncomfortable as they possibly can !! . The site where we have our holiday caravan , which I won't name , has one or two people who appear to live there , or certainly spend most of their time on site . One of these persons actually has the unit next to ours . Whenever we go there , this guy , who is divorced , is always the most sociable of neighbours , we are on first name terms and he often joins us and other holiday owners in a "get-together" for a few bites and beers . Never been an issue .
I certainly do not have a problem with this , and I know that the Park owner is aware and he is certainly a person who would not let a "problem" evolve .
Edit by Darren- No need for un-related made up rubbish, we are not that type of forum
Cheers
Mike R .

[TreeTops]

Originally Posted by treetopper

As I said in other threads maybe that is why more and more sites seem to be are going for the 12 months while they can get them.

The way I understand it, even with the current laws there's nothing to stop the longer season being taken away from the park by the council if they are not playing ball. It' happened to a big park in Towyn a number of years back.

[TreeTops]

Originally Posted by michaelr1946

I think quite honestly ,that this is another blatant example of "Big Brother " wishing to poke the nose into the lives of ordinary people ( the easy option !! ) , and if at all possible , make their bit of pleasure in life as uncomfortable as they possibly can !! . The site where we have our holiday caravan , which I won't name , has one or two people who appear to live there , or certainly spend most of their time on site . One of these persons actually has the unit next to ours . Whenever we go there , this guy , who is divorced , is always the most sociable of neighbours , we are on first name terms and he often joins us and other holiday owners in a "get-together" for a few bites and beers . Never been an issue .
I certainly do not have a problem with this , and I know that the Park owner is aware and he is certainly a person who would not let a "problem" evolve .

Cheers
Mike R .

Whilst I'm totally against the use of caravans as a permanent residence, I share your big brother concerns. Making the honest majority of caravan owners prove that they meet the criteria to own a caravan seems to be bit of a sledge hammer to crack a nut.

In reality there's lots of social issues related to people living on parks. The govt are not worried about the odd person here and there, but there are parks where there's a lot of this going and people are becoming a drain on services. Do you have any good suggestions as to how it could be controlled in a sensible way which would not impact unduly on "real caravanners"?

There's a bit of background info on our website: http://www.treetopscaravanpark.co.uk.../caravan_usage
and
http://www.treetopscaravanpark.co.uk...home_usage_faq

Cheers

Andy

[michaelr1946]

One possibility , and a fairly simple one if you think about , would be for site owners to ask anyone whom they consider "suspect" , to produce a utilities bill ,( i.e; Water, gas ,leccy) in their name , and relating to the home address .
What do you reckon ??.
Mike R .

[TreeTops]

Originally Posted by michaelr1946

One possibility , and a fairly simple one if you think about , would be for site owners to ask anyone whom they consider "suspect" , to produce a utilities bill ,( i.e; Water, gas ,leccy) in their name , and relating to the home address .
What do you reckon ??.
Mike R .

I had thought that perhaps the park owners could be required to ask a sample of the customers for proof. Maybe 10% or 20%, with the option to target the heavier users.

[Maddy]

I kid you not with online b illing that's harder than you think. Our council tax demand covers us for April May and June but that's the only proper paper bill we get.